| Author | Message | ||
     Rosemeadow Senior Member Username: Rosemeadow Post Number: 581 Registered: 01-2008 Rating: N/A |
My latter attempt of grafting onto very young rootstock didn't work. I have to get my rootstock growing more healthy or vigorously. I also tried budding onto rootstock just growing from roots that had been left in the ground after I moved my garden to a different spot on our property. And on also on some Species roses and on a Iceberg bush, anything I could find to graft onto. No luck, except one I found the other day that I found I had missed taking the tape off. Will check it again tomorrow. I find they can look alright until you take the tape off and then they die after a bit. Two of my grafts have buds on them. I have had five sucesses but I accidently killed one. Thats out of many, many attempts. These were done on the rootstock canes that Roseman and brought me and showed me how to de bud them and get them to take root, last Autumn. | ||
| Ozeboy Senior Member Username: Ozeboy Post Number: 483 Registered: 03-2007 Rating: N/A |
Well done Alee, you are getting some good advice from Dao and Brownthumbs. Sometimes we blame our budding technique for failures but you can't beat having the rootstock growing really well when budding. The buds also have to be taken from a rose growing really well. Some years ago I trialled buds on slow growing rootstock by grafting 3 buds onto that rootstock and they all failed. Then I trialled 3 more on stock that was growing extra well and all the 3 buds took well. I concluded the failure was due to the rootstock. | ||
| Brownthumbs Intermediate Member Username: Brownthumbs Post Number: 122 Registered: 01-2008 Rating: N/A |
hippy like | ||
| Alee Intermediate Member Username: Alee Post Number: 131 Registered: 02-2008 Rating: N/A |
what is the meaning of hippyesk ?? | ||
| Brownthumbs Intermediate Member Username: Brownthumbs Post Number: 121 Registered: 01-2008 Rating: N/A |
don't get too stressed out about it there mate...obviously the quicker the better...i aim for a couple of minutes max...with you at home you'll "bud one...patch one" i'll go back a few weeks later to cut heads off and there will always be ones that the patch slave has missed...usually if the bud is good in the first place then the eye will still take..it's not ideal but nature will always find a way hey! I just reckon you should aim to run in several hundred eyes on existing bushes this season and get a hang of the budding process but much more importantly you need to get a "feel" for the budwood and the rootstock or host plant...it's "vibe " as it were..moisture content...sapflow....fast budwood...slow budwood...how your feeling...how the plants are feeling...sounds a bit hippyesk I know. | ||
| Dmaivn Senior Member Username: Dmaivn Post Number: 2914 Registered: 07-2003  Rating: N/A |
Airflow will affect the quality of budding. I notice that if the cambium layer is exposed to air over 10 seconds, the quality starts to suffer. That's why T budding is nice in the sense that you can insert the scion in quickly and worry about the tie action later. With patch budding, you should try to get the scion fitted to the patch on the host within 10-15 seconds. You can prolong that time indefinitely by spraying clean water on the wound and the scion. | ||
| Alee Intermediate Member Username: Alee Post Number: 125 Registered: 02-2008 Rating: N/A |
Brownthumbs and Dao, When budding and patching do you think it will dry up soon in our climate as well? How many seconds do you think I have before I bud or patch to the host? | ||
| Dmaivn Senior Member Username: Dmaivn Post Number: 2912 Registered: 07-2003 Rating: N/A |
Alee, do you keep a saucer under your pots? I always keep saucers under pots because it helps to hold about 1/2L or more of water in case of a windy or hot day. The bark slips very easily when there is growth of the cambium layer between the wood and the bark. The cambium layer transport nutrients from the leaves down to the roots. As it hardens over time it becomes another layer of wood. That's why you have two layers of new wood each year for spring and autumn. I find it helpful to keep saucers for the pots and spray a little liquid fertiliser on the leaves before budding. It helps the leaves to grow vigorously making the cambium layer grows and that make the bark slip. Keeping the tape on for 2 weeks also help a lot as the moisture helps the healing. Patch budding can be useful for beginners. The success rate is higher and the union is stronger. It's a slower procedure and you risk drying out the tissues. Therefore you may need to use a water sprayer just to keep the tissues wet. | ||
| Brownthumbs Intermediate Member Username: Brownthumbs Post Number: 119 Registered: 01-2008 Rating: N/A |
hi Alee...the bark was "tight" due to a lack of moisture in your budwood.....pump the water into your stock plants over the course of it's growth and the wood should snap off nicely. slightly shorter section below the eye and slightly longer section above the eye next time. I would have experimented with leaving the tape on for say...two weeks and see if you could get some calousing(white) around the area...it just gives things a beter start if you can.....well done though | ||
| Alee Intermediate Member Username: Alee Post Number: 124 Registered: 02-2008 Rating: N/A |
Dao, I have done air layering on 8 local rose, which were growing very well at a government building. I am going to use these plants as mother plants for my rootstock. I was amazed to see how easy it was to remove the bark when there is good sap flow on these plants. I have also planted a local rose at cemetry to collect rootstock in future. My air layering on Mrs. B R Cant has rooted. I have potted it. Previously I have tried putting local rose cuttings in sand to root them. But I did'nt have much luck. That's why I am trying air layering. Dao, do you think it is because of my balcony and the cement walls radiating heat? | ||
| Rosemeadow Senior Member Username: Rosemeadow Post Number: 544 Registered: 01-2008 Rating: N/A |
Thanks for that imformation Dmvain, its good to know I don't have to do all the budding in November. I will always keep bushs of rootstock going from now on, I have many young bushes going now. | ||
| Dmaivn Senior Member Username: Dmaivn Post Number: 2895 Registered: 07-2003 Rating: N/A |
Alee, the problem you have is simply that the host did not have enough sap flow at that moment. Similarly your budwood probably did not have enough sap flow. You need to do it when both are growing quickly and have a decent amount of leaves. It's more critical for the bark of the host to slip easily. You will soon find out that even when you have success, the graft only becomes strong if you get everything right. Karen, the "perfect budding season" can last as long as you like depending on the condition of the rootstock. For example, if you have a large bush of rootstock, you always have young canes at any time of the year except the coldest 4 weeks in winter. You can get 100% success budding on the rootstock bush at any time. Then you root the budded cuttings. If you bud on rooted cuttings, you have a window between Oct - Dec to do the job. However if you have a shady area to work and a little misting system to use, you can extend this season over summer right into autumn. You can even extend this into winter if you have a green house. So the major factor is the condition of the rootstock (should slip the bark and have lots of leaves). The budwood is not as important. You can always cut into the wood. Therefore the rose budwood does not need to have slipping bark. My next set of experiment will introduce a different process of patch budding that is unlike what seen out there. I will film it to show every one. I hope it will produce high success rate. | ||
| Rosemeadow Senior Member Username: Rosemeadow Post Number: 538 Registered: 01-2008 Rating: N/A |
I would like to thankyou here too. Dmavin and Ozeboy for your demonstrations, your grafting manuel script Dao, and emails both of you have sent me. Ozeboy when you gave me a budding knife and budding tape that really got me started, and the budwood you gave me Dao. Unfortunately I broke the graft on one of the Ingrid Bergmans the other evening when I was grafting my new budwood onto the neighbouring rootstock to it. I should'nt have been doing it so late bud I wanted it done before the budwood dried out. I moved the guard around the two Ingrid Bergmans to weed around where I was working. I only saw it the next day. So the grafts are very fragile, and it had a little bud or bloom on it too. The good news there is one left, lucky there had been two of them or I would have been very upset. The imformation you put on this thread was interesting and helpful, Dao. A few questions, how long can this pefect budding season last ? I lost some of my rootstocks when I replanted them in the ground, they didn't have as good as roots as I would have thought in the spot I struck them in ( A large steel box). Also I planted them out a bit late in Spring or started too late trying to strike them in Winter. So I am going to bud onto any growing Rootstock and Iceberg, Burundy and Pink Iceberg too, and then cut the rootstock canes off and strike next Winter. Will this work ? Good luck with your graftting Alee. | ||
| Alee Intermediate Member Username: Alee Post Number: 115 Registered: 02-2008 Rating: N/A |
Dao, I did three buddings on my very first attempt. This is one of them. The other two did't make it, it dried out. It was very difficult to remove the bark after the T-cut. The bark seem to stick to the trunk tightly. I would like to thank Dao and the members of this forum for teaching me this trick of budding. | ||
| Dmaivn Senior Member Username: Dmaivn Post Number: 2894 Registered: 07-2003 Rating: N/A |
Alee, it looks good. I believe the connection of cambium veins happen anywhere between 2-6 days but the first connection is very week. That's why we need the tape to be in place to hold it. After about 2 weeks there would be enough healing tissues to secure the graft. The tape puts pressure on the scion to make sure that the growth of callus tissues would not push it out. Is this your very first attempt? If it is, you are doing a lot better than most of us! | ||
| Roseman Senior Member Username: Roseman Post Number: 413 Registered: 05-2004  Rating: N/A |
Alee, just came in and looked at your budding. Good job. No need for fancy stuff, if what you have done works use it. As the bud swells can we have updates of it  | ||
| Alee Intermediate Member Username: Alee Post Number: 113 Registered: 02-2008 Rating: N/A |
I have done my very first budding about three weeks ago. I budded Jude the Obscure on local pink rose. I used 'Thread seal tape' used by the plumbers, as budding tape and Olfa Snap Blades. It works fine for me and is very cheap. I checked the bud after 6 days and seems to have taken. The below picture is about three weeks after budding.  |
